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Grand Canyon Rim-Rim Water-Electrolytes


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Home Forums General Forums Philosophy & Technique Grand Canyon Rim-Rim Water-Electrolytes

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  • #3810359
    Jason H
    BPL Member

    @bjhuffine

    Very curious of others’ takes.  My son and I will be backpacking the GC heading out end of this week.  I posted something earlier about altitude sickness and got some fantastic responses.

    A lot of the responses regarded water and electrolyte intake.  We come from the Southeast US and are used to hot and humid summers but maybe not the dry heat of the desert.  There are plenty of information out on electrolyte and water intake and I believe we’re good there.  I plan to keep on me at least (3) 1 liter bottles.  I have electrolyte tabs for the water as well.

    I know this is a dumb question, but I noticed a difference fluid intake methods in some online research.  Most just talk about electrolytes but I found one article that seemed to indicate electrolytes all the way and another that said one electrolyte bottle and another water, sipping from both.

    Again, sorry for the dumb question.  Temp may be great for us, today interior was 83F, at Phantom Ranch, but I’m still curious, especially from those of you who’ve done the June, July, or August desert heat.  Curiosity has the best of me even if temps aren’t super high while we’re there though if things change I do want to be prepared too.

    #3810365
    Matthew / BPL
    Moderator

    @matthewkphx

    I get fatigued when I have tried to only drink electrolyte flavored water. An approach I have used before is to have a smaller bottle with a couple electrolyte tablets in it. I’ll take a gulp of the concentrated electrolyte mix and then go back to regular water for a while.

    Sometimes I’ll carry two flavors of tablets or satchets and make the short bottle with one strawberry and one grapefruit to keep things interesting. Also I like having electrolyte mixes with caffeine handy.

    Black Cherry Cliff Bloks are another favorite. Energy + caffeine + sodium (no potassium). Not the lightest option but they go down really well and allow you to dose on the go.

    I like having options and variety. I figure it out as I go. I’m just a hiker not an elite athlete running ultras or cycling double-centuries. You are asking about different scenarios and I’m trying to advocate for a flexible approach where you figure it out on the trail. Tablets and sachets are light and space efficient so you can probably afford to carry a couple extras.

    Have a good trip and please share a trip report with us!

    #3810384
    David Thomas
    BPL Member

    @davidinkenai

    Locale: North Woods. Far North.

    For my numerous Rim-River-Rim day hikes in the GCNP and my rarer R2R2R day hikes, I just drink water and eat a variety of food which tends to be somewhat salty.   That’s worked for me in every month of the year, including August with 105-110F in the inner canyon.  Many of those trips were while I lived in the mild climate of the SF Bay Area and more recent ones while living at sea level in Alaska at 60N.

    I try to minimize how much I sweat by leaving crazy early in the morning to make it back up before the heat of the afternoon; wearing light clothes and a broad-brimmed hat; sometimes bringing a sunbrella (I should do that more); and applying fresh water to my shirt and a bandana / MF strip on my neck.  If I sweat 1/2 or 1/3 as much, I’ll retain 1/2 to 2/3 of the electrolytes I’d have lost, right?

    #3810401
    Bill Budney
    BPL Member

    @billb

    Locale: Central NYS

    Electrolytes are important but not complicated. 2:1 salt (NaCl) to No-Salt (KCl) gets you pretty close. Something like 1/8 to 1/5 of a teaspoon per liter of water. That’s the majority of sweat-replacement required.

    You need magnesium in much larger quantities but you only sweat a little bit, so better to just carry magnesium tablets (taurate, citrate, or glycinate): 400mg/day.

    You need calcium, too, but it is best to get that in your food (mostly dairy if you tolerate it, small fish with bones if you do not): whey protein powder, cheese, powdered milk or cream. You don’t lose much when you sweat, so no need to put it in your electrolyte drink.

    Gatorade Zero packets come pretty close to the right balance and are much more economical than other electrolyte mixes that get so much hype. Combined with salty food they achieve the “ideal” balance that you lose to sweat. Gatorade has been making sweat-replacement electrolyte mixes for athletes for decades — they know as much about it as any of the more expensive brands.

    TLDR: Gatorade Zero (or home mix) and protein powder are great for backpackers. Most North Americans should supplement magnesium separately.

    EDIT: Or, as Dave Thomas says, just eat salty food. There’s potassium in almost everything you eat, so sodium is the main thing that you need to replace when sweating.

    #3810402
    Jerry Adams
    BPL Member

    @retiredjerry

    Locale: Oregon and Washington

    “Light” salt is 50% sodium, 50% potassium. So, you do 2 parts light salt and 1 part regular salt to get 2:1.

    Or just light salt would be close enough.

    Put in a plastic bag, then add some to your water.

    Or make cookies or whatever

    #3810403
    David D
    BPL Member

    @ddf

    Gear skeptic’s detailed analysis of the situation led him to recommend Salt Stick caps.  Small, light, simple.

    I find these make things easy, stored in the hip belt pocket and taking one with a snack bar between meals.  No hassle with mixing stuff, or dealing with spent packaging.

    My hands and toes used to swell up fairly significantly, especially on really long winter hikes, a symptom of electrolyte deficiency.  I don’t notice it any more after taking these caps.

    #3810408
    Diane “Piper” Soini
    BPL Member

    @sbhikes

    Locale: Santa Barbara

    I hiked the entire Arizona Trail last year and I hiked the Grand Canyon on May 31/June 1. It felt pretty hot down there but I was at the bottom only in the morning. I managed to hike down and back up to my nice shady campsite before noon. The hike up was pretty hot and despite being in pretty tip-top condition I found myself feeling a bit dizzy and sort of running from shady spot to shady spot and taking breaks.

    My strategy for the entire trail was to take a Salt Stick cap along with some other supplements and medications in the evening. Otherwise, I drank water during the day and once in a while I drank an Emergen-C drink or a Crystal Light lemonade. I did not overconsume water. I didn’t sip all day from a hose. When I stopped for lunch or to fill up water, I would often drink my mixed drink, which was a way I was able to not have to carry quite as much water.

    Overconsumption of water is a danger as much as dehydration. It’s called hyponatremia. If you are really feeling bad try pouring water on your head (or someone else who is suffering) before drinking even more water.

    Salt Stick caps (not the chews) are really good because they have more potassium than others as well as magnesium, calcium and Vit D which is a better combo than most sugary electrolyte drinks.

    #3810409
    David D
    BPL Member

    @ddf

    >Overconsumption of water is a danger as much as dehydration. It’s called hyponatremia

    Swollen digits is one symptom of hyponatremia.  A good early detection test is to check a ring to see if it has a tighter fit.   If so, time for a salt cap.

    On one hand, over hydration can cause hyponatremia.  On the other hand, if I don’t hydrate heavily, I get digestive issues which can be very uncomfortable to say the least.   So the Salt Stick caps also allow a heavy level of hydration for my gut while avoiding hyponatremia.

    #3810410
    David Thomas
    BPL Member

    @davidinkenai

    Locale: North Woods. Far North.

    My measure of hydration is “When did I last pee?”  If I don’t recall or if it was dark or stinky, I’m way behind on dehydration.  If it frequent and voluminous, I may be over-doing it.  If I’d applied much of that water to my clothing directly, instead of running it through my stomach and sweat glands, I’d get the same cooling without depleting my electrolytes.

    #3810414
    David D
    BPL Member

    @ddf

    >If I don’t recall or if it was dark or stinky

    If I wait that long, I can kiss the Kaybo goodbye for a few days.

    So the water levels are as much about that as cooling, for me at least.

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